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ABC cars - How many and where are they.?

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1 year 10 months ago - 1 year 10 months ago #942 by Andrew Kelsey
ABC cars - How many and where are they.? was created by Andrew Kelsey
There weren’t that many made.David Hales in his article on this site estimates 1500.
The Milntown ABC collection (the Bob Thomas collection) in the Isle of Man has two:
A 1921 and a 1924





David’s Supersport is now in Sweden



There is one in the Classics museum in Hamilton New Zealand:







Ir would be interesting to know how many exist and where they are.

Does anyone know of others?
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Last edit: 1 year 10 months ago by Andrew Kelsey. Reason: added picture

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1 year 10 months ago - 1 year 10 months ago #947 by Andrew Kelsey
Replied by Andrew Kelsey on topic ABC cars - How many and where are they.?

This red ABC.is in the USA - at the Lane Museum, Nashville, Tenesee



Any others in the British Isles ?
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Last edit: 1 year 10 months ago by Andrew Kelsey.

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1 year 10 months ago - 1 year 10 months ago #948 by Andrew Kelsey
Replied by Andrew Kelsey on topic ABC cars - How many and where are they.?
Here is an unusual one!
A 1922 modified ABC
these photos are from Graces Guide.
It used to be in the “Bygones Museum” Holkalm Hall.
Present whereabouts unknown.



It has become water cooled!
The large radiator bears the ABC badge,
There are Twin SUs, distributor and coil ignition, cycle wings and large front brakes and numerous bodywork alterations.



What would Granville B have made of it?
Can anyone supply any more information about it?
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Last edit: 1 year 10 months ago by Andrew Kelsey.

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1 year 10 months ago #950 by Lillebror
Replied by Lillebror on topic ABC cars - How many and where are they.?
What happened to the other pushrod?

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1 year 10 months ago - 1 year 10 months ago #952 by Andrew Kelsey
Replied by Andrew Kelsey on topic ABC cars - How many and where are they.?
Lillebror, I suspect it started life as a Supersport engine something like this


where the pushrods are totally enclosed
or the perhaps with modified valve cover from an earlier version:


He certainly seems to have an affinity ( and great skill) working in copper


But where is it - and where are the others?
Is there one in the Motala museum in Sweden ?

Andrew
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Last edit: 1 year 10 months ago by Andrew Kelsey.

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1 year 10 months ago #955 by dhales
Replied by dhales on topic ABC cars - How many and where are they.?
To all those interested in the cars side of ABCs, I was interested to see a number of images on the forum recently.

The red car in the Lane Collection I have no details of but it is a standard 2-seater c.1922/3. I did email the collection for details some year or two ago but did not get a response.

The only Supersports surviving as far as I know is that of Hakan Sandberg in Sweden (ED 4358 Ch.1447 Eng.1497S). This car was first rebuilt by G de Jongh from two cars, the other being PE 8447 which had Eng.1512S. That was eventually fitted with a Ford 10hp engine and sold to Kent and seems to have permanently disappeared. Other cars to survive are as follows:-

NT 1816 (Ch.384 Eng.392) last listed in Oxfordshire.
DA 5948 (Ch.417 Eng.424, now with 760). Round collection.
NL 2425 (Ch.441 Eng.452, now MN 2222) Isle of Man.
XF 9566 (Ch.474 Eng.481) presently in Shropshire.
JS 1478 (Ch.683 Eng.683) presently in Isle of Harris - same owner since 1957.
SA 5459 (Ch.687 Eng.694) presently in Belgium as far as I know.
AU 6121 (Ch.779 Eng.779) ex-Blake car much modified former Birkin car as per photos on the forum. Appears in the ABC scrapbooks now at Brooklands Museum around 1931. Presently at Holkham Hall, Norfolk.
KK 199 (Ch.1028 Eng.1037) Presently in Germany as far as I know.
KK 6 (Ch.1029 Eng. 1034) Was in Kent - could be the Lane Collection now?
RK 1204 (Ch.1372 Eng.1380) The other Isle of Man car.
? (Ch.1410 Eng. 1435) presently in New Zealand as far as I know.

A South African contact many years ago reported a car in a scrap yard in Mozambique - presumably now gone.
Several VSCC specials used ABC car engines most of which have been wrecked.

The earliest production car I have a note of had the Chassis No.27, with Engine No.53 - registered in January 1921, although there were a few registered in 1920, including S C H Davis' car used in trials - PB 5551.

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1 year 10 months ago #956 by Lillebror
Replied by Lillebror on topic ABC cars - How many and where are they.?
KK199 was for sale in Motor Sport February 2004. German MOT and asking price £16.500. Did it sell?

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1 year 10 months ago - 1 year 10 months ago #957 by Andrew Kelsey
Replied by Andrew Kelsey on topic ABC cars - How many and where are they.?

dhales wrote: To all those interested in the cars side of ABCs, I was interested to see a number of images on the forum recently.

The red car in the Lane Collection I have no details of but it is a standard 2-seater c.1922/3. I did email the collection for details some year or two ago but did not get a response.

The only Supersports surviving as far as I know is that of Hakan Sandberg in Sweden (ED 4358 Ch.1447 Eng.1497S). This car was first rebuilt by G de Jongh from two cars, the other being PE 8447 which had Eng.1512S. That was eventually fitted with a Ford 10hp engine and sold to Kent and seems to have permanently disappeared. Other cars to survive are as follows:-

NT 1816 (Ch.384 Eng.392) last listed in Oxfordshire.
DA 5948 (Ch.417 Eng.424, now with 760). Round collection.
NL 2425 (Ch.441 Eng.452, now MN 2222) Isle of Man.
XF 9566 (Ch.474 Eng.481) presently in Shropshire.
JS 1478 (Ch.683 Eng.683) presently in Isle of Harris - same owner since 1957.
SA 5459 (Ch.687 Eng.694) presently in Belgium as far as I know.
AU 6121 (Ch.779 Eng.779) ex-Blake car much modified former Birkin car as per photos on the forum. Appears in the ABC scrapbooks now at Brooklands Museum around 1931. Presently at Holkham Hall, Norfolk.
KK 199 (Ch.1028 Eng.1037) Presently in Germany as far as I know.
KK 6 (Ch.1029 Eng. 1034) Was in Kent - could be the Lane Collection now?
RK 1204 (Ch.1372 Eng.1380) The other Isle of Man car.
? (Ch.1410 Eng. 1435) presently in New Zealand as far as I know.

A South African contact many years ago reported a car in a scrap yard in Mozambique - presumably now gone.
Several VSCC specials used ABC car engines most of which have been wrecked.

The earliest production car I have a note of had the Chassis No.27, with Engine No.53 - registered in January 1921, although there were a few registered in 1920, including S C H Davis' car used in trials - PB 5551.


David, that is enormously helpful, thank you !

RK1204 the 1924 car became MAN 67D when Bob Thomas registered in here in the IoM.
From information you supplied me previously, we know that he purchased it from the estate of Vic Derrington the famous engine and exhaust tuner in 1974. It had been in a corner of his workshop in Kingston, Surrey from the mid 1930s.


AU 6121 is quite fascinating..”ex Blake car”. do you have any further information regarding its history ?
On that very long scuttle, there are two framed pictures, presumably telling the story and the owners but it is not legible.
I read that The Holkam Hall cars were auctioned in 2016 - Perhaps they kept this one?

MAN 67D and MN 2222 are due some routine maintenance this afternoon.If the weather improves and other vehicle chores done, one, possibly both will be out on the road.

Andrew
Last edit: 1 year 10 months ago by Andrew Kelsey.

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1 year 9 months ago #962 by Lillebror
Replied by Lillebror on topic ABC cars - How many and where are they.?
Inproving rockers in the ABC engine was of interest in the twenties.
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1 year 9 months ago - 1 year 9 months ago #966 by Andrew Kelsey
Replied by Andrew Kelsey on topic ABC cars - How many and where are they.?
Liilebror, The 1921 ABC Regent ( MN 2222) at Milntown House in IOM appears to have the F.E.W. modified rocker gear you refer to you from your attached Light Car and Cycle Car article Oct 17t( 1924.

Regarding A B C. car numbers and whereabouts, it would seem largely from information supplied by David, that there are possibly around 10 - 12 world wide.

I would welcome any news of others !

Andrew
Last edit: 1 year 9 months ago by Andrew Kelsey.

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